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Published: 2017-03-04 11:17:06 +0000 UTC; Views: 1610; Favourites: 27; Downloads: 4
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Hundreds of Babies' Remains Found at Former Irish Catholic-run Home for Unmarried Mothers
Irish government investigators said Friday that up to 800 remains of babies have been discovered in a mass grave at a former Catholic home for unmarried mothers.
The discovery confirmed a local historian's claim that the children may be in an unmarked grave at the former Bon Secours Mother and Baby Home in the western Irish town of Tuam.
Ireland's Mother and Baby Homes Commission said excavations revealed an underground structure that contained "significant quantities of human remains."
The commission said DNA analysis confirmed the ages of the children ranged from 35 weeks to three years. Records show the babies died between 1925 and 1961, the last year the home was open.
Burying the remains of babies in unmarked graves was a relatively common practice at Catholic-run homes in Ireland when there were high mortality rates in the early 20th century.
The government launched an investigation in 2014 after local historian Catherine Corless found death certificates for nearly 800 children who resided at the facility, but a burial record for only one baby.
"Everything pointed to this area being a mass grave," Corless said. She recalled how boys playing in the area had reported seeing a pile of bones hidden in an underground chamber in the mid-1970s.
The Catholic church operated many of Ireland's social services in the 20th century. Some housed tens of thousands of unmarried pregnant women, including rape victims.
Unmarried women and their babies were then viewed as a stain on Ireland's reputation as a fervently-Catholic country.
The fathers of some of the babies were powerful figures, such as priests, the wealthy, and married men.
The Minister for Children and Youth Affairs, Katherine Zappone, said the news was "sad and disturbing." She added that an investigation would continue and a decision would be made to determine what should happen with the remains.
www.voanews.com/a/hundreds-of-…
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Comments: 50
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... this was way too on point. I loved Maher, he always knew exactly what to say.
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Yep, he seems to said several good things, it appears to me. Clever guy, for sure.
"George Bush prayed a lot about Iraq, but he didn't learn a lot about it."
Maherwww.imdb.com/title/tt0815241/q…
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YEAH!!! 
I had to think about this movie, too, when hearing from this one!!! Great movie, btw!
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Well, I don't know much 'bout him, tbh. But he hardly can be worser than Trump is. So, yeaaah! Maher for prez!!!
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So, I have some followers and each of them label me as something different; how many followers do I have? I'm just curious to know
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Not only how many, also who, is not unimportant, don't you think?. 
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True, true...most of the people that follow me, I don't even know who they are, but they say they know me somehow; I guess you're right someone is watching me 👀
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"In quantum mechanics, wave function collapse is said to occur when a wave function—initially in a superposition of several eigenstates—appears to reduce to a single eigenstate (by "observation")."
"In Schrödinger's cat experiment, a cat in a box, whose fate is decided by subatomic particles, is both alive and dead until someone looks at it"
- The Consciousness Interpretation, in which collapse occurs when a consciousness becomes aware of it
rationalwiki.org/wiki/Quantum_…
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I see, I see. So, even though I'm not what people say I am, I am what they say I am when they see what they say I am at the moment I am what they say I am...or...because they don't know what I am or understand why I am the way I am, they try to guess what I am based on those who are close to I am and I am what they say I am because I am what I am in the way they say I am (that makes more sense now)
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Interesting point of view! 
(I suppose it stressed her in any kind of way or I don't know why. He took that as an example, why he published some works anonymously...)
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Yep, I can see that (I treat everyone, I meet, differently and whenever it's a group of people, I behave in the way the I treat the person I like the most in the group, which is why I'm more expressive with my brother and sister compare to any other family members, friends, and other random strangers). I guess I'm not consistent enough to give people a good understanding of the person I am.
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And what do you think of that what Arthur said?
“A man can be himself only so long as he is alone; and if he does not love solitude, he will not love freedom; for it is only when he is alone that he is really free.”
A. Schopenhauer
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Hmmm...I don't if you or anyone else would consider it freedom or being free, but if I'm ever alone or in solitude, I would be considered dead; like I'm able to think freely, let my imagination run wild, and/or let my mind wander in my motion less and lifeless state. So, I'm happy with being dead, but since others don't like it, I feel obligated to create fake personas of myself to make them happy or not worry about my well being as much. So, what are you when you are alone and free?
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Yep, I feel free, when being alone! Very!
So that is what I'm currently reading a little bit "Don Juan", by Byron, we'll see, what you will make out of that, now
If from Great Nature’s or our own Abyss
Of Thought,
2
we could but snatch a Certainty,
Perhaps Mankind might find the path they miss;
But then ’twould spoil much good philosophy –
One System eats another up – and this
5
Much as old Saturn ate his progeny
3
–
For when his pious Consort gave him Stones
In lieu of Sons, of these he made no bones.
4
–
2.
But System
5
doth reverse the Titan’s breakfast,
And eats her parents – albeit the digestion
10
Is difficult; pray tell me, can you make fast,
After due search, your faith to any question?
Look back o’er ages – ere unto the Stake fast
You bind yourself,
6
and call some mode the best one;
Nothing more true than
not
to trust your Senses –
15
And yet what are your other evidences?
7
For me – I know nought – nothing I deny
8
–
Admit – reject – contemn – and what know
you
,
Except perhaps that you were born to die?
And both may after all turn out untrue;
20
An Age may come, Font of Eternity,
When nothing shall be either old or new;
Death, so called, is a thing which makes Men weep
–
And yet a third of life is past in Sleep.
9
–
4.
A Sleep without dreams, after a rough day
25
Of toil, is what we covet most;
10
and yet
How Clay shrinks back from more quiescent clay!
11
The very Suicide that pays his debt
At once without Instalments (an old way
Of paying debts, which Creditors regret)
30
Lets out impatiently his rushing breath
12
–
Less from disgust of life, than dread of death.
4
5.
’Tis round him – near him – here – there – every
where
13
–
And there’s a courage which grows out of Fear,
Perhaps of all most desperate, which will dare
3
5
The worst, to
know
it; when the mountains rear
Their peaks beneath your human foot, and there
You look down o’er the precipice,
14
and drear
The Gulph of rocks yawns, you can’t gaze a minute
Without an awful wish to plunge within it. –
40
6.
’Tis true you don’t – but pale – and struck with
terror
Retire – but look into your past impression!
And you will find, though shuddering at the mirro
r
Of your own thoughts, in all their Self-Confessi
on,
The lurking bias, be it truth or error,
45
To the
Unknown
a secret prepossession –
To plunge with all your fears – but where? – you
know not –
And that’s the reason why you do – or do not. –
7.
“But what’s this to the purpose?” you will say.
Gent. Reader! – nothing – a mere speculation –
5
0
For which my sole excuse is, ’tis my way;
Sometimes
with
, and sometimes without occasion,
I write what’s uppermost – without delay;
This narrative is not meant for narration,
But a mere airy and fantastic basis
55
To build up common things with common places.
15
5
8.
You know – or don’t know – that great Bacon saith
“Fling up a straw, ’twill show the way the Wind
blows”;
16
And such a Straw, borne on by human breath,
Is Poesy, according as the Mind glows –
60
A paper-kite which flies twixt life and death –
A shadow which the Onward Soul behind throws;
And mine’s a bubble – not blown up for praise,
But just to play with as an infant plays.
17
9.
The World is all before me – or behind;
18
65
For I have seen a portion of that same,
And quite enough for me to keep in mind;
Of passions too I’ve proved enough to blame,
To the great pleasure of our friends, Mankind,
Who like to mix some slight alloy with Fame –
70
For I was rather famous in my time,
Until I fairly knocked it up with Rhyme. –
10.
I’ve brought this World about my ears – and eke
The other – that’s to say the Clergy – who
Upon my head have bid their thunders break
75
In pious libels by no means a few;
19
And yet I can’t help scribbling once a week,
Tiring old readers – nor discovering new;
20
In youth I wrote because my Mind was full –
And now because I feel it growing dull
petercochran.files.wordpress.c…
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Hmmm...that was a very interesting read (it's been awhile since I've read a poem; thanks
As for my thoughts, it seems like how our thought process, ideals, views, and opinions go through our lifetime and inevitability that it will become we what fear (changed, the same as our parent's or the previous generation, irrelevant/forgotten, and/or not perfect). I can relate with this in a way, but I want to one thing first: ideas/views can be set by society and learned from/taught by our parent's or other individuals/mediums in our life, but can we know about things without learning/taught the concept or even introduced to it in any shape or form?
Any ways, I always and still had the fear of change ever since I was a kid, which did happen to me in middle school. Fortunately, my old self came back in High school and coexist with my new self till this day (So, I have a dominate side that can never change and small flexible side, since my old self existed longer than my new self).
What about you? What do you fear will happen to your views/thoughts/opinions on life as you get older? Or do you have another interpretation for this poem? I'm just curious to know
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So you have a multiple personality?
Georg Christoph Lichtenberg — 'The thoughts written on the walls of madhouses by their inmates might be worth publicizing.'
Well, I hope my views will change, I see it as a development. I had different opinions in many things, as a teenager, as I have it now.
Meeting again
"A man who had not seen Mr. K. for a long time greeted him with the words: “You haven’t changed a bit.” “Oh!” said Mr. K. and turned pale."
from Bertolt Brecht
Means, Mr. K was not happy about that "compliment", cause what he experienced in the meanwhile after a "long time" didn't changed him at all, no development in his personality, nothing learned!
My interpretation, but your's will be differently for sure
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Maybe...in my head; they are not so obvious in the cartoons or movies, especially when each of them pop up on specific situations or to certain people (like I said before, I treat everyone I meet differently). I guess the OC's I created gives an idea what goes on in my head.
As for the concept of change, I don't see it having an effect on personal growth unless it's a significant change. Changing your mind, making a different choice, or doing things differently is not really a change; in my opinion, real change comes from a traumatic event that one can never forget, undo, or fix (I should know because of my own experiences and what I done to others). I'm happy to hear you remember your past self and your old views because like Mikan said in Danganronpa 2, "memories are the most important part about anyboby for all their experiences makes them the person they are now; to lose those memories, makes you a shadow of the past" (kind of like ghost trying to figuring out who you are, which is what significant change does; the more experience you have after that point, the more lost you are and the less of person you become). So, the fact you still remember means you just changed your mind about something and that hasn't had a major impact on your total persona as a whole, which is why most of time people don't see changes in people no matter how much experience they had. So, that's why I hate "change"; it's not real or it kills people (personality wise or literally), but that's just my crazy thoughts/opinions and I don't know what I'm talking about.
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But doesn't everyone does that? I mean treating everyone differently, you talk different to a child than to your teacher, mother, doctor.. f.e. and also different with officialls like police, lawyer, judge than with good friends...?!?
Yep, that true, traumatic stuff or war kind stuff and such kind of things changing people much more, than little stuff (I imagined Mr. K went through a war and then someone is coming and telling him, he didn't changed at all?!? Wouldn't that be sad?) Though I think little changes can become a big one, too, when they "accumulate, like drops on a stone, you know?
Abou forgetting, I'm not so sure 'bout that. Some things, I didn't forgot, others I definitly have and I'm glad about that! You want to remember really everything and everyone constantly? 
“It is hard enough to remember my opinions, without also remembering my reasons for them!”
Nietzsche
“The universe is change; our life is what our thoughts make it.”
M. Aurelius
Forgetting belongs to all action, just as both light and darkness belong in the life of all organic things. A person who wanted to feel utterly and only historically would be like someone who was forced to abstain from sleep, or like the beast that is to continue its life only from rumination to constantly repeated rumination. For this reason, it is possible to live almost without remembering, indeed, to live happily, as the beast demonstrates; however, it is generally completely impossible to live without forgetting. Or, to explain myself more clearly concerning my thesis: There is a degree of insomnia, of rumination, of the historical sense, through which living comes to harm and finally is destroyed, whether it is a person or a people or a culture. — On the Use and Abuse of History for Life, §1.
Nietzsche www.thenietzschechannel.com/qu…
Friedrich Nietzsche — 'The snake which cannot cast its skin has to die
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Well...I guess I don't have multiple personality after all (that's good to know).
Yeah, that would be sad if no one notice if a change did happened, but it always depends on the person how impactful the change is (big changes can have little to no impact as well as the smallest change can have the biggest impact on certain people). Also, I don't know if everyone can noticing an internal change well as they can with outer change (not many people can see beyond what they see).
As for the water drops on the stones, I guess it happen after a while, but it has to consistent and a choice to make the commitment, unlike New Years resolutions that most of time last for a month or 2 and then, it's forgotten the rest of the year. Kinda like the choice to never change I made when I was in 1st grade is still what I committed to do now (I don't know if it's more a choice or a change of mind at that point, since I never cared about change until that point in time). This also reason why I started remembering everything that matters the most to me (I also like that one Twilight Zone episode, where in the future with few jobs and a poor economy, a man can pawn off his forgotten memories for money to live on. However, it affected his personality and thinking process because he felt incomplete. Unfortunately, he couldn't get them back since the pawn shop owner already sold them off, but he did replace them with other people's memories, which may him complete but inconsistent at the same time). Anyways, I think I can remember stuff that make to me because I'm constantly reminding myself with stuff old and new related to that memory (for example: I enjoy Scooby-Doo as a kid and I've watched every other version of it; it also gave me a love of mystery and comedy, which I always look for books, movies, and shows). I guess people are drawn to certain things because it's similar to what they like in the past (they can always check on something new and if it has a major impact on them, then I will either change their interests or be added to the ones they currently have).
But my sister already pointed it out before that she doesn't like how I constantly repeat things and surround myself with familiar stuff...so, I do this during my own time and let others show me their stuff as well (my sister is constantly showing me stuff I might not like as well as stuff I might like).
I'm really enjoying these conversations; it's been awhile since I had long discussion without people wanting me to keep my thoughts to myself or to not talk at all. Thanks
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Yep, that's true, some people resist any kind of change and not to forget some change in a negative way...
`bou remembering, still I agree with Nietzsche, that forgetting is a blessing.
Also I have only a limited capacity in my brain, so for new infos (and many new infos are very interesting!!!), I have to 'delete' some former infos
Also I'm not so sure if the memories are real. Isn't it subjective very often only?
What do you think of that btw: www.theguardian.com/science/20…
Sigmund Freud: 'One day, in retrospect, the years of struggle will strike you as the most beautiful.',
tbh, I normally also avoid such kind of talks. But from time to time, it is okay, I guess
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Yep, I'm one of those stubborn Taurus people that choose not to change and remain living the same.
But yeah, I can see how one can be happier forgetting bad memories and implanting new/better ones like the Grandfather in "Kubo and the Two Strings". I'm a little curious about are people really happy with living a lie and they would never want to seek the truth of their past (it just reminds me a story, I want to read, about a girl who constantly loses her memories writes down her daily life in her notebook and has a neurologist for a boyfriend to help remember who she is).
I, then, to exaggerated and lie from time to time...so, I guess memories could be subjective; that was a very interesting and scary article about doctors having the ability to manipulate memory with certain techniques and/or drugs.
I also like that qoute from Freud, where in time, you will appreciate what has happened to you in life, good or bad, because it made you who you are.
You also remind me of my sister; even she doesn't like what I have to say or what pops in my head, she willing to listen and share her thoughts and opinions.
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Well, I seem to be a typical auarius kind of person
"Aquarius personality is very independent, any attempt to hold them down or restrict them will cause them, to flee. They need to be free to be on their own. Independence is not just desired by Aquarius, it is essential to their well being."
"Taurus is not the one who ventures out into the unknown and leads the way, Taurus is the one that will follow the leader and strengthen and build upon the discovered, in other words they are the one that will "dot the I's and cross the T's". This perseverance is given to them by their stubborn streak. Taurus stubborn streak is what gives their independence. They like to do things their way. They are perfectly fine on being alone, this way things get done they way they want them to be done. Taurus is not a follower, but they are not the brave one either. Taurus is perfectly independent. With their perseverance, they get things done and can do quite well for themselves."
zodiac-signs-astrology.com/zod…
About living a lie and being happy. Guess they're not. Another question also could be, is anything real at all?
"The universe might just be one "vast and complex hologram". And our vision of life as being in 3D may just be an illusion.
That's according to astrophysicists who have studied the cosmic microwave background, or the afterglow that is left over from the Big Bang. After doing so, they have found substantial evidence that our universe is holographic, they said."
Yep, I like this Freud quote, too. Think it true. "true" in holographic way, maybe
I'm glad that you didn't decided not to change in childhood, anyways...👍: 0 ⏩: 1
Wow...my little brother is also an Aquarius, which is why me and my sister let him do whatever he wants since he can take care of himself (he does occasionally get into trouble and we have to lecture him on it, but he learns by making mistakes/experiences).
Thanks for the reminder of a Taurus' characteristics as well; I missed reading daily horoscopes in the newspaper as well as the "Non-Sequitur" and other comics.
As for the article, I can see as the universe as a holographic with some issue with the article; like I don't believe we live in a 3 dimensional world (mabye a 4th or 5th dimension, where 3-D films and CGI has come a long way to look real to the audience, some people can see it being fake compared to older practical effects like makeup, costumes, robots, and puppets...but I can't wait for holograms to be more available to have Yugioh battles like in the show). Have you also seen the show, "Serial Experiment Lain"? I really like how ahead of it's time when it comes to the concept of technology and what's reality and what's not.
I also see life as a game, where we are the play things of a more realistic being and we live as long as we made the game interesting or disregarded whenever they get bored of us ("The Game of Life" is also a nice song).
Lastly, thanks...I'm also happy you are the way are to have a nice conversation with. There are very few people I can talk about these sort of things without weirding them out or becoming concerned with my mental state
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I don't believe in these horoscope stuff, especially after I had a very good friend for years and she was Aquarius, too and very much the opposite of me, in every imaginable way. But I read them, when coming across some magazines. Lately happened again and the next month will be great of course, they said (as always)
Yeah, also have read somewhere, that there have to be even between 7- 11 dimensions, to make it mathematically correct, the "reality"
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I see, I see; I don't know about much Aquarius since they pretty much do their own thing...so I wouldn't know if all Aquarius do the exact same thing while each of them live their life in their own way.
Also, interesting...very interesting; do you know what these other dimensions contribute to our reality by any chance?
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Oh sure you can find out something about that in the www.
It's long ago, but when I remember right, they said, that these dimensions are pretty small, that's why we don't/ can't recognize them, wounded up also somehow.
That, we can't recognize the full reality, maybe?
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Interesting, very interesting...well, if it's true that "we can't see reality fully", then that could mean we are not completely real or we are not trying hard enough to see the full reality. Like if a character/person is 2D, that would mean they can't see things in 3D or higher and can only see things in 2D or less (So, does this mean the more dimesions we have, the more real we are? Or our reality is limited to our own maximum number of dimesion and any higher numbers or variety of numbers are various possibilities for other universes' realities). We could also have seen these dimensions in our reality, but we haven't come up with a name or concept for it (for examples: 1D are lines and dots; 2D are closed shapes with lenght and width; 3D is addition of depth and/or height; this is what I know so far based on math beside n^x, where n represent the object and x is the number of dimensions you choose to give to n; a cartoon told me that 5th dimension is space and time, but I don't know how accurate this statement is, especially since they didn't said what the 4th dimension includes). In the end, there are two possible conclusions I can come up with: 1) we are not as real as we think we are and beings with more dimensions are creating/controlling us like toys, drawings, characters on a TV show probably for their own entertainment or some other purpose we can't understand or 2) even though we haven't figured out or name the other dimensions in our reality, we are still real even though we don't have a full understanding on what makes us real in the first place. What do you think?
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www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGQmdo…
and
www.youtube.com/watch?v=GPcHEt…
New inspirations maybe for your thoughts
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Ok...for the first video, I, honesty, counted 15 times; saw the guy in the gorilla suit and the ones in black leaving; noticed the colors of the curtains changing, but forgot about it afterwards. Based on what I experienced, I see that one can't see everything and there's always distractions that mess with your vision of the truth...this also reminds me of a psychology test my sister gave me for her homework to test how well I notice change (in the end, she said that not many people get perfect scores, since we only focus on what catches our eye/interest and ignore everything; as for me and easily distracted people, we can notice more changes, but forget them easily if something new keeps popping up).
As for that scene from South Park, I can see that as a possibility (maybe they were the reason for Trump's presidency and not the Russians...so, we can still have drama for everyone's entertainment).
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Think you're sister is very right, very!
Yep, it seems we are on the "right" way. They won't stop sending our crazy "show"
www.youtube.com/watch?v=Td7G5K…
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALWJ8G…
ball playing again www.youtube.com/watch?v=yT2ten…
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Yeah, she's a smart kid. Also, for some reason, I can't hear the one about the wormhole theory, but I found the first two pretty interesting:
First of all, are black holes made up of anti-matter (since most matter release/transfer energy to another object; so, anti-matter does the opposite and absorb energy)? So, does this mean the anti-matter universe and the matter universe somehow mesh with each other in a way that they can coexist at the same time, but this does mean that our universe is incredibly unstable and another big bang can happen at any moment.
As for the other one, that's pretty interesting of the concept the less dimensions a object has, the more real it is and the more dimensions, the more of a illusion it is. So, illusions has the ability to create reality, but illusions can make themselves real or are not aware they are not real to ever consider making themselves real. I wonder if the 2D reality are not aware of the higher dimesions because either they don't know it exist or they just don't care cause we are not real to them.
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Interesting meditations, you have! Descartes?:
But what then am I? A thing which thinks. What is a thing which
thinks? It is a thing which doubts, understands, [conceives], affirms,
denies, w
ills, refuses, which also imagines and feels.
Certainly it is no small matter if all these things pertain to my
nature. But why should they not so pertain? Am I not that being who
now doubts nearly everything,
who nevertheles
s understands certain
things, who affirms that one only is true, who denies all the others, who
desires to know more, is averse from being deceived,
who imagines
many things, sometimes indeed despite his will, and who perceives
many likewise, as by the intervention of the bodily organs?
Is there
nothing in all this which is as true as it is certain that I exist, even
though I should always sleep and though he who has given me being
employed all his ingenuity in deceivin
g me? Is there likewise any one
of these attributes which can be distinguished from my thought, or
which might be said to be separate
d from myself? For it is so evident
of itself that it is I who doubts, who understands, and who desires, that
there is no reason here to add anything to explain it. And I have
certainly
the power of imagining likewise; for although it may happen
(as I formerly supposed)
that none of the things which I imagine are
true, neverthele
ss this power of imagining does not cease to be really in
use, and it forms part of my thought. Finally, I am the same who feels,
that is to say, who perceives certain things, as by the organs of sense,
since in truth I see light, I hear noise, I feel heat. But it will be said that
these phenomena are false and that I am dreaming. Let it be so; still it
is at least quite certain that it seems to me that I see light, that I hear
noise and that I feel heat. That cannot be false; properly speaking it is
what is in me called feeling;
10
and used in this precise sense that is no
other thing than thinking.
From this time I begin to know what I am with a little more
clearness
and distinction than before; but neverthele
ss it still seems to
me, and I cannot prevent myself from thinking, that corporeal things,
whose images are framed by thought, which are tested by the senses, are
much more distinctly known than that obscure
part of me which does
not come under the imagination. Although really it is very strange to
say that I know and understand
more distinctly these things whose
existence seems to me dubious, which are unknown to me, and which
do not belong to me, than others of the truth of which I am convinced,
which are known to me and which pertain to my real nature, in a word,
than myself. But I see clearly how the case stands: my mind loves to
wander, and cannot yet suffer itself to be retained
within the just limits
of truth. Very good, let us once more give it the freest rein, so that,
when afterwards we seize the proper occasion
for pulling up, it may the
more easily
be regulated
and controlled.
Let us begin by considering
the commonest matters, those which
we believe to be the most distinctly comprehended,
to wit, the bodies
which we touch and see; not indeed bodies in general, for these general
ideas are usually a little more confused, but let us consider one body in
particular.
Let us take, for example, this piece of wax: it has been
taken quite freshly from the hive, and it has not yet lost the sweetness of
the honey which it contains; it still retains somewhat of the odour of the
flowers from which it has been culled; its colour, its figure, its size are
apparent; it is hard, cold, easily handled, and if you strike it with the
finger, it will emit a sound. Finally all the things which are requisite to
cause us distinctly to recognize
a body, are met with in it. But notice
that while I speak and approach the fire what remained of the taste is
exhaled, the smell evaporates, the colour alters, the figure is destroyed,
the size increases,
it become
s liquid, it heats, scarcely can one handle it,
and when one strikes it, no sound is emitted. Does the same wax
remain after this change? We must confess that it remains; none would
judge otherwise. What then did I know so distinctly in this piece of
wax? It could certainly
be nothing of all that the senses brought
to my
notice, since all these things which fall under taste, smell, sight, touch,
and hearing, are
found to be
changed, and yet the same wax remains.
Perhaps
it was what I now think, viz. that this wax was not that
sweetness of honey, nor that agreeable scent of flowers, nor that
10
Sentire.
particular
whiteness, nor that figure, nor that sound, but simply a body
which a little while before appeared to me as perceptible under these
forms, and which is now perceptible under others. But what, precisely,
is it that I imagine when I form such conceptions
? Let us attentively
consider this, and, abstracting
from all that does not belong to the wax,
let us see what remains. Certainly nothing remains excepting a certain
extended thing which is flexible and movable. But what is the meaning
of flexible and movable? Is it not that I imagine that this piece of wax
being round is capable
of becoming square and of passing from a
square to a triangular figure? No, certainly
it is not that, since I imagine
it admits of an infinitude of similar changes, and I nevertheless do not
know how to compass the infinitude by my imagination, and
conseque
ntly this conception
which I have of the wax is not brought
about by the faculty of imagination. What now is this extension? Is it
not also unknown? For it becomes greater when the wax is melted,
greater when it is boiled, and greater still when the heat increases;
and I
should not conceive
[clearly]
according to truth what wax is, if I did not
think that even this piece that we are considering
is capable of receivin
g
more variations in extension than I have ever imagined. We must then
grant that I could not even un
derstand
through the imagination what this
piece of wax is, and that it is my mind
11
alone which perceives it. I say
this piece of wax in particular, for as to wax in general it is yet clearer.
But what is this piece of wax which cannot be understood
excepting by
the [understanding or] mind? It is certainly
the same that I see, touch,
imagine, and finally it is the same which I have always believed
it to be
from the beginning. But what must particularly
be observed
is that its
perception is neither an act of vision, nor of touch, nor of imagination,
and has never been such although it may have appeared formerly to be
so, but only an intuition
12
of the mind, which may be imperfect and
confused as it was formerly, or clear and distinct as it is at present,
according as my attention is more or less directed
to the elements which
are found in it, and of w
hich it is composed.
Yet in the meantime I am greatly astonished when I consider [the
great feeblenes
s of mind] and its proneness
to fall [insensibly] into
error; for although without giving expression to my thought I consider
all this in my own mind, words often impede me and I am almost
deceived
by the terms of ordinary
language.
For we say that we see the
same wax, if it is present,
and not that we simply judge that it is the
11
entendement
F., mens
same from its having the same colour and figure. From this I should
conclude
that I knew the wax by means of vision and not simply by the
intuition of the mind; unless by chance I remember that, when looking
from a window and saying I see men who pass in the street, I really do
not see them, but infer that what I see is men, just as I say that I see
wax. And yet what do I see from the window but hats and coats which
may cover automatic machines? Yet I judge these to be men. And
similarly solely by the faculty of judgment which rests in my mind, I
comprehend tha
t which I believed
I saw with my eyes.
A man who makes it his aim to raise his knowledge above the
common should be ashamed to derive the occasion
for doubting from
the forms of speech invented by the vulgar; I prefer to pass on and
consider whether I had a more evident and perfect conception
of what
the wax was when I first perceived it, and when I believed
I knew it by
means of the external senses or at least by the common sense
13
as it is
called, that is to say by the imaginative faculty, or whether my present
conception
is clearer now that I have most carefully
examined what it
is, and in what way it can be known. It would certainly be absurd to
doubt as to this. For what was there in this first perception which was
distinct? What was there which might not as well have been perceived
by any of the animals? But when I distinguish the wax from its external
forms, and when, just as if I had taken from it its vestments, I consider
it quite naked, it is certain that although some error may still be found
in my judgment, I can nevertheless not perceive it thus without a human
mind.
But finally what shall I say of this mind, that is, of myself, for up to
this point I do not admit in myself anything but mind? What then, I
who seem to perceive this piece of wax so distinctly, do I not know
myself, not only with much more truth and certainty,
but also w
ith much
more distinctness and clearness
? For if I judge that the wax is or exists
from the fact that I see it, it certainly
follows much more clearly that I
am or that I exist myself from the fact that I see it. For it may be that
what I see is not really wax, it may also be that I do not possess eyes
with which to see anything; but it cannot be that when I see, or (for I no
longer take account of the distinction) when I think I see, that I myself
who think am nought. So if I judge that the wax exists from the fact
that I touch it, the same thing will follow, to wit, that I am; and if I
judge that my imagination, or some other cause, whatever it is,
persuades
me that the wax exists, I shall still conclude
the same. And
13
sensus com
munis.
what I have here remarked of wax may be applied to all other things
which are external to me [and which are met with outside of me]. And
further, if the [notion or] perception of wax has seemed to me clearer
and more distinct, not only after the sight or the touch, but also after
many other causes have rendered it quite manifest to me, with how
much more [evidence] and distinctness must it be said that I now know
myself, since all the reasons which contribute to the knowledge of wax,
or any other body whatever, are yet better proofs of the nature of my
mind! And there are so many other things in the mind itself which may
contribu
te to the elucidation
of its nature, that those which depend on
body such as these just mentioned, hardly merit being taken into
account.
But finally here I am, having insensibly reverted
to the point I
desired,
for, since it is now manifest to me that even bodies are not
properly speaking known by the senses or by the faculty of imagination,
but by the understanding only, and since they are not known from the
fact that they are seen or
touched, but only because
they are understood,
I see clearly that there is nothing which is easier for me to know than
my mind. But because
it is difficult to rid oneself so promptly of an
opinion to which one was accustomed for so long, it will be well that I
should halt a little at this point, so that by the length of my meditation I
may more deeply imprint on my memory this new knowledge.
Meditation selfpace.uconn.edu/class/perce…
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Well...that was a very interesting read:
So, something (in this case, wax) has a distinct look, smell, taste, sound, and feel, which our senses determined it is real and it is what it is. Then, a change happened (melting the wax), which changes the thing's original characteristics/features and/or makes it difficult to judge with our 5 senses (does this mean the wax is no longer wax or is it still wax even though it loses everything that made it wax in the first place?).
Now, this may be a trick for me to appreciate the concept of "change" more, but I will play along. I can say that wax is still wax no matter what shape or form, but it is not same wax it once was before; it would be like if I lost a leg, I would still be a human being (even though, I don't look like the average normal human), but my personality, outlook, perspective, and/or character may change to a certain degree, depending on how traumatic the change process was. The only way I can remain the same is to lie to myself and go into denial that I never lost a leg. However, even if I replace it with fake one, the reality/truth is still in the back of my mind, that a change has happened and the old me is gone.
Now, if this has to do with the concept of reality, it kinda reminds me of a show called, "Chaos Head", where illusions can become real and change reality. Now, this piece wax is withness by one person in this scenario; so, this phenomenon/change is experienced by this single person, which can come to question from others reading/listening to this story, did it really happened or was it just illusion, imagination, or lie? The only way people can believe this is real if they experienced the same thing and/or were in the same room (for example: I've seen wax melt, but I never taste, smell, or listen to it; so, can I believe wax taste like honey, smell like flowers, or make a sound if I tap it? I would have to use my imagination and lie to myself/assume it to be true rather than knowing it is the truth). Now, if we have the ability to lie/deceive ourselves on what's real, is anything real or are we pretending things are real? This is also why it's difficult to deceive others with illusion, without knowing either what they experienced or knowing how strong their suspension of disbelief. I feel like I'm just rambling now and the back of my mind is telling me that I say this thing before; so, I will stop and say these are my thoughts for now. Have a nice day
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Lost leg? you took as an example? tTe same he did in VI
6. Firstly, then, I perceived that I had a head, hands, feet and other members composing that body which I considered as part, or perhaps even as the whole, of myself. I perceived further, that that body was placed among many others, by which it was capable of being affected in diverse ways, both beneficial and hurtful; and what was beneficial I remarked by a certain sensation of pleasure, and what was hurtful by a sensation of pain. And besides this pleasure and pain, I was likewise conscious of hunger, thirst, and other appetites, as well as certain corporeal inclinations toward joy, sadness, anger, and similar passions. And, out of myself, besides the extension, figure, and motions of bodies, I likewise perceived in them hardness, heat, and the other tactile qualities, and, in addition, light, colors, odors, tastes, and sounds, the variety of which gave me the means of distinguishing the sky, the earth, the sea, and generally all the other bodies, from one another. And certainly, considering the ideas of all these qualities, which were presented to my mind, and which alone I properly and immediately perceived, it was not without reason that I thought I perceived certain objects wholly different from my thought, namely, bodies from which those ideas proceeded; for I was conscious that the ideas were presented to me without my consent being required, so that I could not perceive any object, however desirous I might be, unless it were present to the organ of sense; and it was wholly out of my power not to perceive it when it was thus present. And because the ideas I perceived by the senses were much more lively and clear, and even, in their own way, more distinct than any of those I could of myself frame by meditation, or which I found impressed on my memory, it seemed that they could not have proceeded from myself, and must therefore have been caused in me by some other objects; and as of those objects I had no knowledge beyond what the ideas themselves gave me, nothing was so likely to occur to my mind as the supposition that the objects were similar to the ideas which they caused. And because I recollected also that I had formerly trusted to the senses, rather than to reason, and that the ideas which I myself formed were not so clear as those I perceived by sense, and that they were even for the most part composed of parts of the latter, I was readily persuaded that I had no idea in my intellect which had not formerly passed through the senses. Nor was I altogether wrong in likewise believing that that body which, by a special right, I called my own, pertained to me more properly and strictly than any of the others; for in truth, I could never be separated from it as from other bodies; I felt in it and on account of it all my appetites and affections, and in fine I was affected in its parts by pain and the titillation of pleasure, and not in the parts of the other bodies that were separated from it. But when I inquired into the reason why, from this I know not what sensation of pain, sadness of mind should follow, and why from the sensation of pleasure, joy should arise, or why this indescribable twitching of the stomach, which I call hunger, should put me in mind of taking food, and the parchedness of the throat of drink, and so in other cases, I was unable to give any explanation, unless that I was so taught by nature; for there is assuredly no affinity, at least none that I am able to comprehend, between this irritation of the stomach and the desire of food, any more than between the perception of an object that causes pain and the consciousness of sadness which springs from the perception. And in the same way it seemed to me that all the other judgments I had formed regarding the objects of sense, were dictates of nature; because I remarked that those judgments were formed in me, before I had leisure to weigh and consider the reasons that might constrain me to form them.
7. But, afterward, a wide experience by degrees sapped the faith I had reposed in my senses; for I frequently observed that towers, which at a distance seemed round, appeared square, when more closely viewed, and that colossal figures, raised on the summits of these towers, looked like small statues, when viewed from the bottom of them; and, in other instances without number, I also discovered error in judgments founded on the external senses; and not only in those founded on the external, but even in those that rested on the internal senses; for is there aught more internal than pain ? And yet I have sometimes been informed by parties whose arm or leg had been amputated, that they still occasionally seemed to feel pain in that part of the body which they had lost,—a circumstance that led me to think that I could not be quite certain even that any one of my members was affected when I felt pain in it. And to these grounds of doubt I shortly afterward also added two others of very wide generality: the first of them was that I believed I never perceived anything when awake which I could not occasionally think I also perceived when asleep, and as I do not believe that the ideas I seem to perceive in my sleep proceed from objects external to me, I did not any more observe any ground for believing this of such as I seem to perceive when awake; the second was that since I was as yet ignorant of the author of my being or at least supposed myself to be so, I saw nothing to prevent my having been so constituted by nature as that I should be deceived even in matters that appeared to me to possess the greatest truth. And, with respect to the grounds on which I had before been persuaded of the existence of sensible objects, I had no great difficulty in finding suitable answers to them; for as nature seemed to incline me to many things from which reason made me averse, I thought that I ought not to confide much in its teachings. And although the perceptions of the senses were not dependent on my will, I did not think that I ought on that ground to conclude that they proceeded from things different from myself, since perhaps there might be found in me some faculty, though hitherto unknown to me, which produced them.
Same to you
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Wow, what a strange coincidence? I just chose "the lost leg" example because I watched "Madagascar 3" early that morning (The Russian Tiger was my favorite character and had the best lines, for me). This passage reminds me of what I experienced in the white room the doctor put me in before the psychiatric can see what's wrong with me (12 hours waiting for him to tell me that there's nothing wrong with me and I can go back to school); yep, a better description of what I said and what I experienced in middle school. Thanks again for the read
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I personally have absolutly no trust in doctors. They assumed about three times cancer, when it came to me, as I was there and it was absolutly NOTHING! The third time, I was amused, almost I even told him that it can't be!!! But let it checked out and suprise suprise after making huge enormous tests and checks and I dunno what, they said there is absolutly nothing. They've seen something in the screen, what suddenly disappeared as they cut me and looked inside
"Under my watchful eye the laws of nature take their course. Thus is the world set in motion; thus the animate and the inanimate are created."
"I am the ritual and the sacrifice; I am true medicine and the mantram. I am the offering and the fire which consumes it, and the one to whom it is offered."
Shiva
(Just to bring something new 
www.patheos.com/blogs/hindu2/2…
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Yep...you think that they spent the longest in college/university (veterinarians are the longest since they have another school to go to learn how to treat animals after medical school), they should, at least, know what they are doing (this makes me worry about my younger brother's career choice). Thanks for sharing
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The fact they were seen as a "stain" makes me wanna vomit.
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That is so terrible! Why do this sort rail against abortion but then have no qualms about killing them after they're born?
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Because it's more sportsman-like that way!
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So they give the baby a gun so it'll have a fighting chance?
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Why not? That makes it more thrilling~
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